|
Post by madoldlu on May 22, 2015 10:47:11 GMT -5
I agree for the most part, but I don't see JT or the rest of the gang being particularly coy or bashful about admitting they want a hit song. Like you said, CB, they are always dropping those words, "relevant" and "staying in the game". I see it as being very up front about their motives. And yes, it disappoints me a bit. I wish they would just write great songs, trends and "novelties" and "hits" be damned. I think the bigger problem is really that they are willing to do ANYTHING to get that elusive hit song, including slumming to Timbaland (ha "slumming" since it cost them hundreds of thousands to work with him!).
At least with Ronson they are on a better, more genuine, track. Ronson loves the band's early music, the music most of us fans feel are the most "true" to the band. And based on AYNIN, it's as perfect a collaboration as they are ever going to get--working with a hitmaker who loves and understands the true Duran sound.
Even the musical guests from AYNIN still sounded appropriate to the band. So yeah, they are adopting this trendy "novelty", but they are doing it right.
To duranfan09's comment about having a rapper: oh gawd I'm so relieved they haven't resorted to that! I suppose it's a personal prejudice, but I can't stand rap. Coldplay had a remix of their song "Lost" and had Jay-Z rap in, it and it was like JZ just took a dump in the middle of the song. There was no attempt to integrate the two disparate musical styles at all. It was as if JZ was just rapping, and the song just happened to be playing in the background. Terrible. And didn't one of the recent remakes of "Do They Know it's Christmas" also have rap in it?
|
|
|
Post by coolbarn on May 22, 2015 15:09:19 GMT -5
Great post Lu I think it comes down to this. I mightn't agree with Duran Duran feeling that they need a hit to stay relevant. To me it is the personal satisfaction of making truly great music that should be an artist's payday, especially a band like Duran Duran who have already been massive at least once in their career and who have more money than they really need. It's like they're saying "We'd rather write a novelty (in John's words) that charts well, than an amazing piece of music that doesn't chart" and I can't understand that whatsoever. It baffles me completely. Surely as an artist it's about the quality of the art - not how much it sells. And I'm saying this as a struggling sole provider for a wife and two children on an average wage, not as a multi-millionaire married to another multi-millionaire where money should not be an object. But I'm not in the band. And I love them unconditionally. So if collaborating with people who can get them hits, and working with younger acts keeps them happy and continuing to make music, then great, I'll accept that. I won't like it. Ever. But I'll understand that it keeps Duran Duran alive and so I'll just be thankful for receiving their music. And every now and then the band might surprise me and release something really good when making these occasional "novelties" or "gimmicks". I always wish the best for the band. But it doesn't stop me pitying them and their decisions from time to time. Working with Mark Ronson and Nile Rodgers, real musicians and producers who know the band and can get the best out of the band, is awesome and not at all gimmicky. But bringing in Lindsay Lohan purely to attract a younger demographic is the ultimate gimmick. Of course I hope it works, and like I said I may even be pleasantly surprised if the end result is good. If the novelty collaborations start to fail though - I don't think all the fans will be so understanding.
|
|
|
Post by crimeandpassion on May 22, 2015 15:37:13 GMT -5
I think this collaboration complaint doesn't yet have merit as we've not heard the album. The past collabs turned out to be some amazing tracks.. Breath After Breath, The Man Who Stolen A Leopard, The Promise, & Election Day.
|
|
razorfox
BIG THING
"Say Hello, To The Bad Guy....... fox, ...razor fox"
Posts: 705
|
Post by razorfox on May 22, 2015 16:14:43 GMT -5
I think it speaks volumes that Warner wanted to sign Duran right away. I also feel that Duran didn't take their experiences with AYNIN too well. I remember Sirius The Pulse playing Falling Down a lot - but I never heard them play the single AYNIN. I suspect that was due to Sony being behind FD and there was no record company behind AYNIN. Duran may also feel that whatever they do as a foursome - even with a record deal - and regardless of how good it is - it is not going to reach the masses they want it to reach. So, they have decided to go in the direction they are going in. I was one of the fortunate ones to talk to JT at the Barrymore theatre in 2007 and we had a real interesting conversation on Timbaland. JT is a pretty insightful guy. So, what he said is I am sure what he firmly believes and to me its really a continuation of that 2007 conversation in that he is really interested on what is going on out there. But I also feel a lot of this is overstated. I suspect their singles prospects are all collaborations - but most of the tracks - like 7 of the 11 - will just be Simon on vocals. Note the guest guitarist is playing on ballads according to Roger. But we are probably talking about only 3 or 4 tracks that have (female) vocals - Pressure off, the Australian artist, and the Lohan sister, and the infamous B. JT seems to be saying that these turned out excellent. Nile has already said that it did on Pressure off. It's not the first time duran has done this - see Come Undone and Breath After Breath. The difference here is that these guests are much more well known - and its probably more likely because of the guests the tracks will get played on radio. As someone mentioned - its going to be an interesting few months on this board. But it keeps coming back to one thing. Warner signed them right away. If this was a so so album in their view or marginally good, I don't think they would have signed them. Too many people have said great things about this cd as well who have heard it. I think its going to be a huge hit for the band. We will soon find out. Thank you, that post made me positive about things to come. It was a post that was not self indulgent and not over analysing. I prefer to sometimes just go with the flow rather than scrutinize every possible path or reason for what they're doing. And at the end of the day if I get about 4 songs I love and always listen to then it's a success in my personal book.
|
|
|
Post by coolbarn on May 22, 2015 20:19:06 GMT -5
I think this collaboration complaint doesn't yet have merit as we've not heard the album. The past collabs turned out to be some amazing tracks.. Breath After Breath, The Man Who Stolen A Leopard, The Promise, & Election Day. No, it's not the actual collaboration themselves, or the quality of the music they lead to. It's the idea that they are required to succeed in this day and age, when they're not. Even if every collaboration Duran Duran ever do results in amazing music, and I honestly hope this is the case, then I'm still concerned the band FEELS that they need to work with other artists to succeed. Look at Duran Duran working with Milton Nascimento as you mention. That was purely for artistic reasons, not commercial ones. Warren knew Milton and how talented he was, and that's how Breath After Breath came about. But you ask any person in the world outside Brazil who Milton Nascimento is, and get ready for the blankest of stares. The band didn't choose him for his star pulling power. Compare that to the band working with Lindsay Lohan, an actress known more for her extra curricular activities and personal turmoils which, according to some unnamed source, the band did so because "they wanted to appeal to a younger demographic". Can you see the vast difference between the collaborations? One was for the art, the other was for the promotion. It's the collaborations based on the latter that concern me, NOT the former. If Duran Duran choose to work with guys like Nile Rodgers, Mark Ronson, and John Frusciante in the future then I'll be happy, because those guys have immense talent and aren't there as a circus sideshow. And Arcadia consisted of a singer, a keyboard player, and half a drummer, so collaboration was what the whole album was about. You're not going to get far with no guitars, and backup singers are nice too. My other point was that it would be refreshing to hear the band talk honestly. Coming out and saying that they chose to work with Timbaland because of the "groove factor" he would bring to the band and how he "covered them in chrome" was silly. Timbaland had never actually worked with a band before. I would have rather have heard them say "Timbaland was the most successful producer available and we felt we had the best chance of charting with him, so we went with him". Short and sweet. Totally unlike my posts. Thank you, that post made me positive about things to come. Hi Razorfox, You're right it is an excellent point. Warner seem very supportive so that's a great first step, and there must be a reason for that. So regardless of my concerns, I'm still looking forward to hopefully a great album from Duran Duran. And also great sales of it if that is what the band wants. It's a very exciting time! It was a post that was not self indulgent and not over analysing. I prefer to sometimes just go with the flow rather than scrutinize every possible path or reason for what they're doing. Yes I analyse a lot. But I think if you're going to write something about Duran Duran, especially something critical, then the least you owe the regulars on this board is to put some effort and thought into it. If I just say "John's interview sucked" or "Duran appear desperate" and don't explain why, then it doesn't say much about me does it? And not all my posts are self-indulgent and over analysing. I'll also occasionally crack jokes that I find hilarious! And at the end of the day if I get about 4 songs I love and always listen to then it's a success in my personal book. Whoa, you're a lot better man than me! You're happy if Duran release 4 great songs from an album that you always listen to? What about the other 8 tracks? What if the other two-thirds of the album is complete pig swill, you will still regard the album as a success? You will be surprised to hear that outside of Duran Duran message boards I am extremely easy-going. I hardly ever get flustered about things; in fact one day it will all build up and I'll probably explode. So if you ever see a mushroom cloud hanging over Australia for no reason you'll know what happened. But not even I am that easy going! If the band can write their first two albums with virtually NO filler after only a few year's playing and writing experience (especially Rio, which is probably the most perfect 9-song pop album you will ever hear) then why can't they continue to do it now that they have been performing together 10 times longer with all that extra knowledge and experience? I would love another perfect Duran Duran album like Rio. AYNIN came extremely close. If all the talk about DD14 is correct, then it certainly has a chance. Mind you all that talk either comes from the band or people working with the band so I'm not getting carried away. But it is nice listening to excited people and positive reviews
|
|
razorfox
BIG THING
"Say Hello, To The Bad Guy....... fox, ...razor fox"
Posts: 705
|
Post by razorfox on May 23, 2015 16:13:45 GMT -5
Please don't take my comments too personally coolbarn, your contribution to this board can not be questioned. Mine on the other hand can, I've been poping in and out sporadically since 2007 with 50% of my input knocking the non existent, crap naming, crap sounding, can't even bare typing it; Meddazaland. I sometimes find your posts filled with a lot of conjecture and that your opinion is pushed over to fact. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your posts and apologize if so but that's how I feel when reading. To be honest I only got 4 songs from AYNIN that I think are smashing and that's the title track, BTM, BF and RR, couple of others I quite enjoy but the rest I could live without, especially the over rated great naming tacky track Leopard, the gushing of love for this tune irritates me but I've got to respect people enjoy it and hold a different view. This is a contradiction to your own view stating it's near on par with Rio as a perfect album. But I class the album a success personally because I've just taken 4 brand new Duran tracks that I can love and for that I'm grateful. I think you're clutching at straws if you reckon you could get a near perfect album again. Rio is obviously an exception and there's no need to go into that further but generally tho everybody has such a varied taste in music and even fans of the same band like Duran are varied in their taste of what they churn out that the chances of having majority of people loving every esscence of an album is a bit far fetched in my view. You ask why can't they continue it now with all that expereience etc, well why can't anyone? The questions vague and there could be a million and one reasons...... I know I'm going to love Pressure Off the song as the chorus is right up my street and feels like a classic Duran track to me so I'm eagerly awaiting getting this one song never mind the rest at the moment. Fingers crossed it's successful for them and us. Oh and if the mushroom cloud does pop up I'll take a minute silence to remember the; "hes so cool you will want to spray him with anti freeze, coolbarn" That felt like a long f***ing post to this illiterate twit, I guarentee you it ain't happening again
|
|
|
Post by coolbarn on May 23, 2015 19:10:06 GMT -5
Please don't take my comments too personally coolbarn, your contribution to this board can not be questioned. Mine on the other hand can No, you contribute well. Guys like you keep wafflers like me in check (although there's not as many wafflers around here as there used to be), and provide some interesting deRhodes when we don't agree on something. And you can say things in one paragraph which take me three quarters of a thesis to write . So I personally value your posts. I've been poping in and out sporadically since 2007 with 50% of my input knocking the non existent, crap naming, crap sounding, can't even bare typing it; Meddazaland. That's something we DO agree on. I'm not going to turn this into a Medazzaland thread, and I do think it contains a few good songs, but overall I regard Medazzaland as Duran's second-worst album to RCM. And if John and Roger had been involved in all of Medazzaland and that was the end result, then I think it would have jumped to number one as the worst. I sometimes find your posts filled with a lot of conjecture and that your opinion is pushed over to fact. Maybe I'm misinterpreting your posts and apologize if so but that's how I feel when reading. Conjecture I can agree on. I can make some pretty grandiose statements based on one interview, or one snippet. But if that is the only information we have on record, and there is no counterpoint, then I'm prepared to run with it knowing I'll have to offer contractions if new or contradictory information is brought to light. But I'd prefer to do this rather than being wishy-washy and sitting on the fence; I have the courage to stick to my convictions and will apologise later down the track if required. I'm no apologist, but will happily apologise However when you say my opinion is pushed as fact, that hurts a little. I assume everybody should know that virtually every post on every Duran Duran board is opinion. I know you get the odd post where facts and figures are presented, or links to articles are posted. And those sorts of posts are factual. But outside that virtually everything else is so obviously opinion that you shouldn't have to type "in my opinion" or "IMO" or even worse "IMHO" every single time. You've seen the length of my posts; I'd be using IMO 157 times per thread, which would make them seem even sillier To be honest I only got 4 songs from AYNIN that I think are smashing and that's the title track, BTM, BF and RR, couple of others I quite enjoy but the rest I could live without, especially the over rated great naming tacky track Leopard, the gushing of love for this tune irritates me but I've got to respect people enjoy it and hold a different view. This is a contradiction to your own view stating it's near on par with Rio as a perfect album. That's cool. And it's interesting hearing from somebody who doesn't think AYNIN is the best thing the band have done since the 80s, as more people seem to love the record than be so-so about it like yourself. So I think it's really great hearing a different opinion on the album. I just think if you get the 9 best songs from AYNIN (which to me means getting rid of all that instrumental garbage, Safe, Before The Rain, and not sure about the third - maybe Leave A Light On?) you're left with 9 great tracks with no filler ala Rio. I know you disagree with that, but that's cool I think you're clutching at straws if you reckon you could get a near perfect album again. Rio is obviously an exception and there's no need to go into that further but generally tho everybody has such a varied taste in music and even fans of the same band like Duran are varied in their taste of what they churn out that the chances of having majority of people loving every esscence of an album is a bit far fetched in my view. I think the band COULD do it. For me. I can't vouch for anybody else, and there is no such thing as an album where everybody loves every song equally. I'm not expecting an album of 10 perfect songs, but I think the band could do 10 tracks where you don't particularly want to skip any like they did with Rio. Even on Rio I have favourites and lesser-lights; the difference is the lesser-lights are still damn good! But they came very close on AYNIN, and I'm hoping that DD14 is even better. I know I'm going to love Pressure Off the song as the chorus is right up my street and feels like a classic Duran track to me so I'm eagerly awaiting getting this one song never mind the rest at the moment. Fingers crossed it's successful for them and us. Totally agree. I really enjoyed the low-quality snippet of Pressure Off after a few listenings (I still thought it was a "grower" rather than a "hit you instant" type of track) and am hoping it sounds amazing when polished up and ready to roll. And I love the phrase "classic Duran" that you used; I'll take classic Duran over experimental Duran every day of the year! Oh and if the mushroom cloud does pop up I'll take a minute silence to remember the; "hes so cool you will want to spray him with anti freeze, coolbarn" Thank you. I think. That felt like a long f***ing post to this illiterate twit, I guarentee you it ain't happening again It was indeed a long post. Welcome to my world, my friend. I knew I would convert you eventually. Muhaha, muhaha, muhaha. (Although if I'm illiterate, I'd hate to see how much literate fans would write!!!)
|
|
|
Post by madoldlu on May 26, 2015 11:08:12 GMT -5
It may seem as if some of us here over analyze Duran's music, and perhaps we do. But I don't think it's done out of malice or us being critical of their work or their motivations. In fact, I think it's the opposite. I think people who are dismissive with their negative comments come across as more antagonistic and derogatory. I personally like to analyze and define what it is about the music that I love, and sometimes that includes trying to figure out what it is about some of their songs that I don't like as much. I wish I was more educated in music so I could be more concise and specific with what I'm trying to say, instead of just saying, "I love the part with the "chigga chigga chigga boom!" And I don't really see people who tend to write long posts pushing their words as fact. Again, I see the opposite--those that write a quick "it sucked", come across more like their opinion is fact and everyone else is a fool. At least those that write long posts try and explain their point of view, and more than often do that with respect and real thought.
However, I do feel that part of what makes Duran such a great band is that their music DOES stand up to scrutiny. There is much more there in the writing and crafting of the songs than the general public give them credit for. And it's nice to read posts, such as coolbarn's for example, that are able to verbalize eloquently what it is I find so captivating in their music. And yes, sometimes that type of conversation does have to include the band's attitudes and motivations behind what they create.
Personally, it's in my nature to analyze and define things I enjoy, like music and movies and art. I am a graphic designer and artist and have been trained to view work in this way, but I think I've always been like that. I suppose it may seem that looking at these things with such a critical eye takes all the fun out of them. But for me it's just a way that I express how much I do enjoy them. You've heard that saying "the opposite of love isn't hate--it's indifference"? If I ever get to the point where react to Duran's music in that "meh" kind of way where I don't even want to bother discussing it, then that's when I'll know that I should drop them. And sadly I've been close to that point a couple of times along the way. But AYNIN has truly re-ignited the flame and I find myself looking forward to hearing more from them!
|
|
|
Post by coolbarn on May 26, 2015 12:27:23 GMT -5
You've heard that saying "the opposite of love isn't hate--it's indifference"? If I ever get to the point where react to Duran's music in that "meh" kind of way where I don't even want to bother discussing it, then that's when I'll know that I should drop them. And sadly I've been close to that point a couple of times along the way. But AYNIN has truly re-ignited the flame and I find myself looking forward to hearing more from them! Wow, I have never heard that saying before. I should get out more! And I kind of understand it. The only thing worse than being talked about, is not being talked about. The fact that there are regulars here posting and debating every day, over a pop band who were last massive thirty years ago and had a very brief comeback in the early 90s, says a lot about how much the band means to us and has changed our lives. Your post made me feel happy Lu. If I didn't care about the band so much, I wouldn't take all the time and effort to write the bullshit that I do. You have just validated my bullshit with one crazy saying. Thank you.
|
|
|
Post by madoldlu on May 26, 2015 13:31:25 GMT -5
LOL! You're welcome! Your posts are great! Always insightful and entertaining! No bullshit!
Never heard that saying before, huh? Part of the meaning is that hate is such a strong emotion--you wouldn't have such a strong emotion for something or someone you didn't care (at least a little) about.
|
|