LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, HERE IS THE NEXT PRESIDENT

[sanman]

carina said:

As much as Hillary and Obama don't wow me now, if they decide to make their platforms only women's issues or black issues, I would write them off so fast.

Hillary would never be so foolish as to exlude 1/2 of the population by only pandering to women. As she has taken the last 4 years to position herself for this race, we have seen her pander to women, to men, to the left, to the center and even to the right and it's all done with a bullshit, plastic smile on her face.

Barack...I fear he is far too idealistic to be elected.

[Carina]

[quote author=sanman board=general thread=1169317657 post=1169419835[/quote]Barack...I fear he is far too idealistic to be elected. [/quote]

I'll use even stronger language: I fear he's too much a pussy to even take a stand on any issue.

[artful dodger]

I don't have a personal experience with socialized health care but my observation is that sometimes some Canadians are healthier than some Americans. I have a Canadian friend who has no qualms about seeing a doctor when he needs it. Everyone I have ever known in the US always always ALWAYS puts off going to the doctor for the simply fact of money...whether it's co-pays or whatever. We would rather try and self-medicate before getting the care we need b/c we are so fearful of any medical bill. And it's exhausting to try and fight with insurance companies and their myriad of policies. I honestly can't say which system is the best but I do feel let down by the current US system. A system which seems to be exclusively geared towards the rich or upper-class. I think everyone should have a basic right to medical care.

[Mediavixen]

Our quality of care here in Canada is very good. We are not the 'old country' with outdated medical proceedures, etc.. Our hospitals and medical community offers the latest in care. In fact, we have one of the leading cancer hospitals in this half of the world at the Princess Margaret Hospital in Toronto. The cancer reasearch and treatment there is excellent.

Our system is also quite progressive as many 'alternative' types of care are also covered.

If I am not mistaken, the US has a higher amount of major disease and death rates from them.

My aunt has lived in Virginia for more than half her life, but still comes home to Canada for much of her medical care. She always says she could never get the same quality of care in the US . And she is married to a surgeon who is quite the big whig in Virginia.

[sanman]

I think everyone is a bit prejudiced when it comes to medical care. I live in Houston, where the largest employer in the city is the Texas Medical Center (the largest medical complex in the world) which delivers some of the best medical care on the planet (MD Anderson is the #2 cancer center in the country and St. Luke's Episcopal Hospital is the site of more heart surguries than any any other hospital in the world). Not sure if everyone knows this or not but Houston is the Energy Capital of the world and the biggest employer in the city is the Medical Center. You can do the math...

www.visithoustontexas.com/media/statistics/Houston_Stats_Texas_Medical_Center

[sanman]

reeneebob said:

I'll take my exhorbitant taxes any day of the week to know that if I or my child or parent was sick I can walk into a hospital and not have to worry about how I will pay for it.

We'll just have to agree to disagree.

Luckily, I and really no one in my family tends towards illnesses that necessitate hospital stays. I pay cash for my doctor's visits as I have a doctor who, by choice, does not accept insurance. In the event we are in need, we have ample insurance to cover the medical care that we require well into our old age. Therefore, this is just not an issue that really concerns me, personally.

Paying taxes in the highest bracket (36%) does concern me, as that is the rate at which I am taxed by the IRS. That's the issue that hits home with me. If my taxes are raised for any reason whatsoever, I will be PISSED, especially if it is to fund programs that I will never take advantage of. I don't nor will I ever participate in any kind of Government assisted program and that includes collecting Social Security, assuming it is still around when I am eligible.

Are these views towards the Government, Government Assitance and Government Regulation radical? Yes. As the granddaughter of a full blooded Comanche Indian, however, my views should not be surprising.

[illumination70]

I hear ya ReneeBob,
A few years back I developed a staph infection on my lower legs and went 4 months with it because I couldn't afford or take the time off to go see a doctor.

[vsb]

I'll do everyone a favor and stay out of the political debate this time. However, I do have a question for the Canadians about wait times: Every so often, US newspaper articles about the health care deRhodes state that wait times in Canada for what is deemed non-emergency surgery can stretch into the years. The articles often then go on to state that rich Canadians are able to fly to the States to get their treatment immediately, while Canadians of less means must wait in the queue, and that the Canadian system therefore really isn't as egalitarian as it would appear. (The point of these articles often is that if the US is going to turn to a national health scheme, a solely single-payer system like Canada's would be less tolerable than a dual-tier system like the UK's or Australia's where people who are willing to pay to jump the queue can enter the private system if they cannot tolerate the wait for procedures that the system deems non-essential.) I am curious as to what the Canadians on the board think of this argument, and to whether they can speak to the difference in wait times for essential/emergency vs. what is deemed elective surgery. Do US articles exaggerate the issue? Have any of you had experience with NON-emergency treatments where you have, or have not, had to wait in a queue? If you had to wait, how long did you go without treatment?

As for me, I am not totally sure where I stand on this issue. When I lived in the US (almost my whole life until last year), I always had coverage through an HMO that paid 100% of the costs of any treatment that I needed (including several surgeries on my knee and a tonsillectomy where I never had to pay a dime, plus long-term medication for a chronic health condition where my only expense was a $5 co-pay for each prescription), so I never had the financial worries about health care that have affected some Americans. And the care that I received through my doctors was always excellent. On the down side, when I quit my job this summer, I had to make fairly expensive COBRA payments to keep my health coverage for the duration of my time in the US once it was no longer covered by an employeer. And now that I live overseas, I would be shit out of luck were I to experience any health problems on my trips back to the US but for the fact that I purposefully acquired an Australian credit card with an EXCELLENT travel insurance package that includes great health insurance that will cover any emergencies that might befall me in the States. So that is the downside of the US system: it can be great if you've got coverage, and scary if you don't.

One of the interesting things about moving to Australia was that I was able to sign up for Medicare, Australia's national health scheme, the day I arrived here. I haven't had to go to the doctor yet so I can't comment from firsthand experience on the quality of care here, but I do know that my mother-in-law has had several eye problems and received excellent care from her eye doctor (a private doctor, mind you, not part of the public system) that saved her from going blind. On the other hand, according to the newspapers here, Australia has been experiencing SEVERE wait-time issues, including people who have had to wait FIVE YEARS to get basic dental care, for example. In another example, a girl I know with serious joint problems desperately needs a hip replacement. But in the public system, she was told that she will need to wait 2 1/2 years for the surgery even though she recently had to go on leave from her job as a social worker since she now can barely walk, and can no longer operate her car. Luckily, she purchased private health insurance several months ago, so she will be able to have the surgery through the private health insurance once the one-year wait period for pre-existing conditions has passed.

I guess where I come out is that I am grateful that I am covered by insurance here in Australia even though neither my husband nor I has an employer to give it to us. But being forced to wait in a queue for rationed care scares me; "free" health care is a joke if you can't get it in a timely fashion except for in major emergencies. Luckily, premiums for private health insurance are much cheaper in Australia than they are in the States, so once we get our acts in gear it looks like we will be purchasing private policies that will enable us to sidestep the queue if we need treatment (and to be placed in nicer hospitals). It is a shame that insurance in the US is so expensive that it is practically impossible for many un- or self-employed Americans to pay for it.

[sanman]

reeneebob said:

You get taxed at 36%? Good god!

I can tell you our taxes are NOT at that level. Low income gets taxed at maybe 10%, middle class income (where I am currently) I get taxed about 22%. However I always...ALWAYS....get income tax refunds every year. Scott and my dad (when he was a government employee) have very very good paying jobs, and they got taxed about 30%.

Some of my income is only hit at the 30% bracket but a big piece is taxed at 36%. Lovely, ain't it?? I'm sure part of it is because I'm single and no have dependents. The other part is because a large bulk of my income is bonus related and gets taxed twice.

It sucks that I can't claim my junkie, drug addict dog as a dependent!!! Talk about medical care....perhaps I should petition the Government about that???

[sanman]

vsb said:

It is a shame that insurance in the US is so expensive that it is practically impossible for many un- or self-employed Americans to pay for it.

I agree. I think all self employed people and small businesses should be able to pool together in order to get group rate insurance and coverage.

When I'm between jobs...I don't go the cobra route, as I'm not a sickly person. It just doesn't make sense for me to carry $400 - $800 a month premiums for those few months. Instead, I get catasrophic, high deductible insurance to bridge the gap between coverages. Premiums are about $75 a month. That way, if I'm in an accident or something, I just get stuck with a deductible rather than having to pay cash for some big hospital stay.