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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2020 0:49:37 GMT -5
Surprisingly though, like The Chauffeur and Secret Oktober, I think So Red The Rose is something that some fans get caught up with, and perhaps even over-rate. For me it's impossible to over-rate So Red The Rose as it's a sublime album to my ears. Same goes for The Chauffeur, which always remains my favourite song by any artist. I'd have given you Secret Oktober as being over-rated, but then it got reworked for live performances in the 90s and that brought it to a whole new level. That version on the Latest and Greatest Tour should have been put down on vinyl. Can I say "sublime" again? For me Election Day is the great lost Duran Duran single, criminally overlooked because it was by the forgotten Arcadia instead of DD. I'd have controversially stuck it on Decade. In honour of So Red The Rose's 35th Anniversary I stuck the vinyl on loud and proud, and Election Day sounded deep and lush to kick-start the album. Beautiful and haunting - every time it comes on it holds me and mesmerises me. Reminds me of when my wife lived in South Africa before we married. It works for me - lack of space meant we get the abridged version instead of the full track, but it sets the scene for that dreamy second side of SRTR. And that beautifully closes that dreamy second side of SRTR. Nothing skippable there for me - it's nine tracks of class. And I get why you feel the vibe is perhaps slower-paced than you would expect from a Duran album as I would agree with that overall - but that's down to the balance of tracks on the album rather than the individual tracks themselves - any of them would fit quite well on a Duran album of that vintage. ‘Missing’ - that’s incredibly private stuff. Thanks for sharing a very powerful and emotive paragraph. I found Arcadia a welcome change to DD in all honesty - a welcomed rest from all the crazy hysteria that followed the band. I do remember people at the time not knowing who Arcadia was.
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Post by stolenleopard on Nov 25, 2020 11:21:44 GMT -5
I'll tell you, SRTR is better than Paper Gods. I've always preferred Simon's dreamy lyrics
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2020 11:41:15 GMT -5
It's a very good album indeed. Duran Duran used some top-notch instrumentalists (no disrepect to John and Andy Taylor fans, of which I consider myself one, but the instrumentalists used on So Red The Rose far surpass those Taylor boys) and it stands out like dogs' balls. The songwriting is great, and the performers lift the album above many other Duran Duran efforts. Surprisingly though, like The Chauffeur and Secret Oktober, I think So Red The Rose is something that some fans get caught up with, and perhaps even over-rate. The Amazing: 1) The Promise. What a beautiful song. Should have been the lead single. The Very Good: 1) El Diablo - Really cool track, amazing bass (like most of the songs!). 2) Goodbye Is Forever - Catchy track, great synths by Nick. 3) The Flame. The Good: 1) Keep Me In The Dark - More of a "classic" Duran sound, a very nice song. The Disappointing / Overrated : 1) Election Day - Tuneless and hookless. How it was deemed worthy of first single, I will never, never know. I'll just assume Duran Duran were testing the waters in releasing the worst track first, sadly something they were to achieve numerous times in the future. 2) Missing - Puts me to sleep. Please wake me when it's over. 3) Rose Arcana - Come on guys, you're just taking the piss now. There are only nine tracks on the record in the first place, and one of them has to be a waste of time 50 second instrumental? 4) Lady Ice - See my "Missing" review - it's just as bad. That is why I believe SRTR to be over-rated - there is just too much skippable stuff on there. Nice, but skippable. Dare I say it - boring (sacreligious I know!). Four years before that, Simon Lebon flippantly claimed that Duran Duran wanted to be "the band to dance to when the bomb drops". Well that is why I never mistake Duran Duran for Arcadia, as there isn't much hip-waving, faster-paced material there. I get that is the vibe that the guys were going for, but I'm just explaining why I can easily tell the difference between Arcadia and Duran Duran. The songs, overall, are very pretty. It is a good album, made even better by the quality of musicians that Simon, Nick, and Roger opted to work with. But I think some of the boring songs get a pass mark by fans for being so different to what we had ever received from Duran Duran up to that point. And as I have said many times before - "Different does not equal good". It simply equals "different". Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad. Overall I prefer The Power Station album (just), as it is more exciting. There is not much between them though - they are both very good, and depending on my mood, there would be days where I prefer So Red The Rose. If every song on SRTR was as good as The Promise, then it would have been the greatest album of all time. But they are not, even considering the talent of the people who played on the record. Am so glad we have material of that quality from both of the splinter groups - it really proved that they could write and perform, and weren't just style over substance Wow! I respectfully completely disagree about Election Day. I found it very catchy. They wanted something a bit different to the Duran sound. I loved it on the radio, particularly because it wasn't copying anything else. It took me just a short time to really warm up to Arcadia because (at the time) I didn't want the band split. I don't think they could have made Notorious and Big Thing without Arcadia. Glad they were brave enough to do this weird album. Absolutely the best album that Duran never made. Way better than Medazzaland, PT, and RCM!
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blaahh
PAPER GOD
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Post by blaahh on Nov 25, 2020 13:32:40 GMT -5
Its better than SATRT and anything from Wedding Album to date (bar AYNIN) in my humble opinion. Its so textured and has so much depth, which SATRT lacks, despite sharing the same producer but I think Gilmour, Mackay, Alomar et al add that (sorry rest of Duran!). I wonder commercially what would have happened if Goodbye Is Forever was the lead off single? Simon is also in the best voice of his career.
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Post by coolbarn on Nov 25, 2020 14:36:13 GMT -5
Absolutely the best album that Duran never made. Way better than Medazzaland, PT, and RCM! I agree with you there, although admittedly that isn't too hard Its better than SATRT and anything from Wedding Album to date (bar AYNIN) in my humble opinion. Its so textured and has so much depth, which SATRT lacks, despite sharing the same producer but I think Gilmour, Mackay, Alomar et al add that (sorry rest of Duran!). I also agree, it is a more mature album than Paper Gods, even though the band were 30 years younger. No Last Night In The Cities or Danceophobias on So Red The Rose - thank God I wonder commercially what would have happened if Goodbye Is Forever was the lead off single? I believe it would have performed so much better. Goodbye Is Forever is a wonderful song, and sounds like a mature (there's that word again!) Duran Duran of the time. I think The Promise was the best choice of lead single, as it has real credibility and class, and would have made people sit up and take notice, but Goodbye Is Forever isn't too far behind.
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Post by La Princess on Nov 25, 2020 15:03:36 GMT -5
Great posts. I remember when it was released and how I had mixed feelings. I was happy there was something with Duran Duran members but sad it wasn't the entire band. Like others, I had no idea that neither Andy nor Roger were coming back and wouldn't be for many years (and for Andy, briefly). Anyway, I had heard Election Day and to me, it sounded like a Duran Duran song but many of the other songs (in particular Lady Ice) sounded different. I got it for Christmas that year along with the Power Station (both on cassette) and ironically a vinyl version of Arena (I already had it on cassette but wanted vinyl). I played it often and created dances for various songs on the album (the Promise, in particular, had a very advanced dance with kicks and a dance where I fly in the year).
Something interesting happened that I never saw coming and it opened my eyes to jazz. It's not a jazz album really but had (at least to my 14-year-old brain) jazzy elements. Because of this album, I started seeking out jazz albums and developed a strong interest in that genre. Before this album, I had been a strictly New Wave/Punk rock and top 40 pop fan but I started seeking out other music. I think this album is the reason we got Notorious which was different than other DD albums.
Recently I have been going through my remaining cassettes to donate many to thrift stores. I have been on this declutter movement and got rid of a lot of items and the cassettes are no different. All of those I replaced on CD I donated because I don't listen to cassette anymore when I have. With SRTR I kept it because I never replaced on CD.
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Post by madoldlu on Nov 30, 2020 15:44:50 GMT -5
I first got into DD around very late 1984, when my older sister “discovered” them watching “Do They Know It’s Christmas”. I had already fallen in love with “The Reflex” earlier that year, so I went along with her new obsession.
We gobbled up a good amount of their stuff by spring of ’85, and by summer I was listening to them full time. I have fond memories of listening to cassette recordings of the vinyl on my very cheap, very big, very red Walkman knockoff on my way to and from school, which was about a half hour away on a bright yellow schoolbus.
I don’t remember quite how we found out about Arcadia, but we knew it was coming and were on the lookout for it. I do remember the first time I heard “Election Day”. My older cousin and I went to pick up pizza for the family, and on the way back, they played it on the radio. I remember not being sure if this song that had just come on was the new Arcadia song, but that it kinda sorta sounded like Simon. Until the chorus hit, and there was no doubt!
I too loved the packaging and design for SRTR. Yes, those numbers were fascinating! So cryptic! I loved how the type went around in a circle. The photography was bright and electric. I thought it was cool how they all dyed their hair black and wore all black suits and outfits. It was a great look for this in-between band. It really all felt like a natural progression from SATRT and Arena.
However, the music was a slight detour from Wild Boys and AVTAK. It was more like the next chapter to SATRT’s more arty sound, which we all loved. We figured the next DD album would pick up where AVTAK left off. Simon’s singing was also very different than before. It took a little getting used to him trying odd vocal styles. The music was sublime. Every song was a jewel, even the short little Rose Arcana, and the long, meandering Lady Ice. We loved the first 3 albums completely from first song to last and all the b-sides that we had. And this new, not quite DD, album was another home run for us.
The album fit the mood of the time for me. I was in 7th grade, just starting middle school. As I mentioned before, the bus rides were long, and I was always plugged in to my Walkman. The evenings got dark early, so listening to the album on the way home from school always felt a little eerie, like something out of a dream.
Election Day has a killer chorus (although some OCD part of me is always annoyed that the chorus is “RE election day”). Keep Me In the Dark is a lovely mid-tempo romantic song. I love Simon’s vocals in this, and the guitars. Goodbye is Forever has a nice melancholy feel with that great, catchy musical guitar riff hook (how the song begins). The Flame as a good strong energy. Missing is a sweet little ballad. Rose Arcana is an interesting bridge (can’t say I’m crazy about the full length version). Of course the Promise is phenomenal. I was into Sting and the Police at the time as well (Sting/the Police was my older cousin’s favorite, and she was the one who guided my sister and I through the beginning of our DD fandom), so it was beyond fantastic to have them collaborate on such a beautiful song—and damm that David Gilmore guitar! El Diablo had a nice latin flavor added, and still felt like it belonged to the rest of the album. And finally the moody and grey Lady Ice. I’ll admit, nowadays Lady Ice is a bit of a slog to get through, but at the time, it was so artsy and bold in its musicality that I enjoyed getting lost in the song. I mentioned this years ago on this forum when the song was being discussed for some reason, but the musical scape is very similar to the soundscape in the end of Full Metal Jacket (which came out in 87).
Releasing the Flame as a single was a nice surprise, especially seeing it as a video which I thought was a lot of fun, and nice to see Mulcahy back together with them. And Say the Word was also a nice surprise as well. Although I was disappointed that the Promise was never released in the US. As everyone has said, it’s an exceptional song.
It was a great time for me in the early days of my fandom. While I would much rather have liked to have a new DD album in the Fall of 85, having the Arcadia album was a nice transition from the first 3/4 albums, and a nice way to wait. Like I said before, Arcadia took what I enjoyed greatly of early DD, the more moody, esoteric songs, and ran with it.
I do remember that I was very much expecting the new DD album to be a mix of this sound and the rockier Wild Boys and AVTAK, so maybe along the lines of Goodbye is Forever and the Flame. Notorious was really way out of left field for me, probably more so because of Arcadia.
I still enjoy the album immensely, although I confess I listen to the radio edit of Election Day.
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Post by negative1 on Dec 16, 2020 9:38:56 GMT -5
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Post by americanscientist on Dec 16, 2020 15:15:34 GMT -5
It’s actually a testament to DD’s pop culture standing in 1985 that a single as obtuse as Election Day went Top 10 in the US.
Keep Me in the Dark and Goodbye is Forever are both far more commercial while The Promise as a single would have surprised a lot of their detractors at the time (it would need to have been edited).
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Post by mic on Feb 28, 2021 14:29:15 GMT -5
A rare case of band's side project that managed to stand on its own feet while at the same time creating a organic transition between 2 very different DD albums like Seven and Notorious. It's a small project that contains some real gems. Also the videos were amazing, pure 80s dreamy nonsense with a decent budget.
I remember how bleak the Notorious videos looked to me at the time, compared to the lush colorful Arcadia visionary trips.
My favorite tracks: El Diablo, Election Day, The Promise, The Flame, Goodbye is Forever
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