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Post by sarahb1863 on Sept 15, 2011 7:05:29 GMT -5
I think any of them can beat Obama. I just hope we make the right choice in who does that. This is an important election and we need to get it right. So who do you think is going to get the nomination? My guess is it's going to be Perry. And if it's Perry, I don't see him winning against Obama; he's scared too many old people with his talk about Social Security, and they're a powerful voting block. He has a lot of other problems too, but that's the main one. Since you've admitted Cain doesn't have a chance...who do you think will get the nom, and how do you think they'll beat Obama? |
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Post by marchmadness on Sept 15, 2011 19:29:35 GMT -5
I think any of them can beat Obama. I just hope we make the right choice in who does that. This is an important election and we need to get it right. So who do you think is going to get the nomination? My guess is it's going to be Perry. And if it's Perry, I don't see him winning against Obama; he's scared too many old people with his talk about Social Security, and they're a powerful voting block. He has a lot of other problems too, but that's the main one. Since you've admitted Cain doesn't have a chance...who do you think will get the nom, and how do you think they'll beat Obama? I think it's between Perry and Romney. I do believe either of them will beat Obama. I won't be particularly thrilled with either of them, but anything is better than what we have currently. I hope if Perry's going to scare anyone that he does it now. I can not stand him!! But I'll be forced to vote for him if he gets the nom because I believe Obama is terrible for our country. I know I'm one of the few conservatives on this board, but even if I were a democrat I'd be very upset with the job Obama has done. Some of the things he has done are just reprehensible. How they will beat him? By not being Obama. At this point that's about all it will take. Even someone as terrible as Perry would beat him, and that's bad. Before anyone jumps all over me for my opinion-I am not a pollster. I don't have any scientific (or otherwise) evidence to prove what I'm saying. It is simply my opinion gathered from what I have been seeing/hearing on tv, radio, and in the world around me. All the people I know who couldn't wait to get out and vote for Obama (I had to tell them what they needed to do to vote!!) are not going to bother voting in 2012. The fact that I helped these doofuses exercise their right to vote for someone I knew would ruin the country shows that I do not "hate" Obama, or democrats (some of my friends are democrats, poor things). I am a little disappointed that people who knew nothing of the world around them elected this guy, simply on the promise of govt feebies. I can only hope that people wise up during this election and realize the rich have gotten richer, the middle class are now the poor and the poor have no chance of getting off welfare as long as he is in office. |
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Post by La Princess on Sept 15, 2011 21:34:05 GMT -5
Marchmadness, I'm not going to attack you for your views at all. In fact I think the fact that you are conservative and have the guts to show it says a lot. Btw, that is not an attack at all, but rather a compliment because I know how some of the extremists (on both sides)get. I've gotten pm's from people who told me they are conservative themselves but afraid to state it because they are afraid of being flamed. I'm no leftie myself (I admit I used to be)and I'll never understand that idea either. I've never understood the idea that people don't see the problems with either party. I'm probably more libertarian than either a Dem or Rep.
I think a lot will do with the economy and how it fares. It does better and I think we'll see Obama re elected.
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Post by marchmadness on Sept 16, 2011 13:07:56 GMT -5
I agree with you. If the economy turns around he will have a chance. I don't think Obama is completely out of the race. It's still salvageable but he has tons of work to do. I just wish he'd vacation the rest of his term away. At least when he's relaxing, no further harm is being done to our country. I won't complain about how many rounds of golf he plays. The more the better!!
I don't think you would attack me for my views. There seem to be a couple people here who seem to sit around waiting for me to post something then start attacking me for my opinion. I don't understand that, but it happens quite a bit. I was adding the disclaimer for them.
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Post by La Princess on Sept 16, 2011 14:09:44 GMT -5
I agree with you. If the economy turns around he will have a chance. I don't think Obama is completely out of the race. It's still salvageable but he has tons of work to do. I just wish he'd vacation the rest of his term away. At least when he's relaxing, no further harm is being done to our country. I won't complain about how many rounds of golf he plays. The more the better!! I don't think you would attack me for my views. There seem to be a couple people here who seem to sit around waiting for me to post something then start attacking me for my opinion. I don't understand that, but it happens quite a bit. I was adding the disclaimer for them. I understand completely. There are a few who do just that. I don't get it, but some people (on both sides)can only see their side. I try to look at the viewpoints on many levels. I will admit though that I don't like how he's going on vacation it seems way too much. I felt the same way about Bush as well. What really gets me especially about Obama is how it seems the vacations seem to be fancy, which is a bad thing in the economical crisis. |
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Post by marchmadness on Sept 16, 2011 21:24:35 GMT -5
I agree with you. If the economy turns around he will have a chance. I don't think Obama is completely out of the race. It's still salvageable but he has tons of work to do. I just wish he'd vacation the rest of his term away. At least when he's relaxing, no further harm is being done to our country. I won't complain about how many rounds of golf he plays. The more the better!! I don't think you would attack me for my views. There seem to be a couple people here who seem to sit around waiting for me to post something then start attacking me for my opinion. I don't understand that, but it happens quite a bit. I was adding the disclaimer for them. I understand completely. There are a few who do just that. I don't get it, but some people (on both sides)can only see their side. I try to look at the viewpoints on many levels. I will admit though that I don't like how he's going on vacation it seems way too much. I felt the same way about Bush as well. What really gets me especially about Obama is how it seems the vacations seem to be fancy, which is a bad thing in the economical crisis. Yes he tells us how we all have to cut back, yet he has lavish vacations on our dime. I think it's money well spent though if it keeps him away from the White House. It's almost like an investment in our future. |
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Post by La Princess on Sept 17, 2011 14:15:41 GMT -5
Yes he tells us how we all have to cut back, yet he has lavish vacations on our dime. I think it's money well spent though if it keeps him away from the White House. It's almost like an investment in our future. I know, it does bother me. For all my dislike of Bush, at least we went to his house in Texas. If Obama went to his house in Chicago I wouldn't care. However, he's gong overseas, to Martha's Vineyard, etc. He's wasting money big time and if he was paying I wouldn't care. I'll get flack for this, but part of the reason we are having financial troubles is the unions. I'm against outsourcing, but part of the reason this happened was because of unions. To me they are just as dangerous as the religious right because they are pushing an agenda. Plus, at least in Illinois the unions are run by the mafia. |
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Post by nightboat13 on Sept 18, 2011 2:16:21 GMT -5
 Where to begin... Let's start with unions. The lie that union workers are greedy and lazy doesn't wash with anyone anymore. Everyone knows what working conditions are like where the multinationals have set up - 10-12 hour days, 6-7 days per week, at a dollar per day or so, children forced to work beside their parents, or out of orphanages, women and girls frequently raped, employees beaten; filthy and dangerous working conditions..., why, it's just as bad as what we had here in the States - before unions gained employee rights. Everyone knows that the poor, frightened, trod upon robber barons had to leave the country because we meanies insist on humane treatment. Seen the air in China lately? Delicious. On vacations, in the first year in office (I can't find verified stats for year two), Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton took fewer vacation days. Both Bushes and Ronnie Ray-Gun took more. Obama's overseas trips were business-related and all side trips were paid for by the Obamas, not the taxpayers. Two of Obama's recent "vacations" were again business related, as can be surmised by his appearances on golf courses. The President does not play or like golf. BTW, the new tour bus being used for the 2012 campaign was ordered by the Secret Service, not Obama. A second one is at the ready for the republican nomminee. Worst President ever? How can he be worse than Bush? Could you cite some facts to back up your claim? Oh, and the jobs bill - History has proven that works programs are successful, austerity measures are nothing but fail. FDR's programs were very successful, that is until 1939, when the newly elected republican majority cut funding for his programs. The economy was sent into a tailspin from which it did not recover during WW2, the war increased the country's debt. It wasn't until the 1950s, when the tax rate on the wealthy reached an all-time high, and veterans were spending their GI loans, that the economy recovered. Eisenhower had a works program, too - the Interstate Highway System.
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Post by sarahb1863 on Sept 18, 2011 9:41:56 GMT -5
I'd like to hear what ideas the Republican candidates have for jobs creation and debt reduction, and specifically how they're better than the president's. Anybody know? The deRhodes aren't much help, all the candidates do is attack each other.
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Post by La Princess on Sept 18, 2011 14:23:35 GMT -5
Where to begin... Let's start with unions. The lie that union workers are greedy and lazy doesn't wash with anyone anymore. Everyone knows what working conditions are like where the multinationals have set up - 10-12 hour days, 6-7 days per week, at a dollar per day or so, children forced to work beside their parents, or out of orphanages, women and girls frequently raped, employees beaten; filthy and dangerous working conditions..., why, it's just as bad as what we had here in the States - before unions gained employee rights. Everyone knows that the poor, frightened, trod upon robber barons had to leave the country because we meanies insist on humane treatment. Seen the air in China lately? Delicious. Unions used to be needed but aren't anymore in most cases. They often allow incompetent workers to keep getting promoted and overpaid. It's a problem when someone doing a generally entry level skill like mail clerk is being paid more than a lawyer. At my former employer management jobs (college grads)were being paid LESS than their subordinates, often for doing the same type of thing. I'd like anyone to explain why this is fair. Oh and at my former employer union people could do anything and not get fired, including drinking, stealing, getting in fights, but management couldn't. I don't feel ANYONE should be doing these things. My grandfather was in upper management at a car company and part of his job was to deal with the unions. The union guys (who were also known mafia thugs)always wanted more and more money. My grandfather thought it was wrong that a person who worked hard and someone who was lazy was paid the same. My grandfather is a Democrat btw. Then there is the case of my father. He lost a job because his boss decided to bring in his son and paid off the Teamsters to make up stories about my dad. My dad vowed then never to work for an union job again. My dad is also a Democrat. Finally, when unions are overpaid, this means less profits for companies. I'm all for CEOs and the like making less, but the stockholders hate it. This is partly why many of these jobs went overseas. Does this mean I support this? Not at all, I hate outsourcing and outsourcing killed our economy. However, I do find it upsetting that someone who is doing a generally unskilled job is making more than a college grad, especially if the job isn't that backbreaking, like the clerical jobs at my former employer. I am NOT talking jobs that require a lot of strength at all, but rather office jobs and jobs that aren't hard. I am a college grad and should be making more than someone I manage. I was an accounting trainer at my last job and making less than the people I trained because I was management and they were union, though I have a Masters and most only had a high school diploma. As for China I find that country disgusting and am repulsed jobs are being sent there. However BOTH parties allowed that to happen. The fact is everytime someone buys a product from China they are supporting an evil country with poor human rights. On vacations, in the first year in office (I can't find verified stats for year two), Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton took fewer vacation days. Both Bushes and Ronnie Ray-Gun took more. Obama's overseas trips were business-related and all side trips were paid for by the Obamas, not the taxpayers. Two of Obama's recent "vacations" were again business related, as can be surmised by his appearances on golf courses. The President does not play or like golf. BTW, the new tour bus being used for the 2012 campaign was ordered by the Secret Service, not Obama. A second one is at the ready for the republican nomminee. I am not a fan of either of the Bushes or Reagan, in fact Reagan destroyed the economy here and caused a lot of what is happening. I thought Bush 2 was the worst president and mentioned that earlier. However, the fact remains that Obama needs to really be working on the economy here and not going on vacations. How many vacations does the average American get a year? One and that's what he should be doing. Like I said, if he was going to Chicago as often as Bush did Texas I would be fine with that. Business related, how so? I don't see anything mentioned on these trips about how he's trying to fix the economy. I saw something mentioned about Obamacare but that's just a mess and something he shouldn't been worried about before the economy. I keep hearing about the various trade agreements, but most of those would destroy the economy even more. Worst President ever? How can he be worse than Bush? Could you cite some facts to back up your claim? I never said Obama was the worst president, I think Bush 2 was. Like I said, I do think Obama inherited a lot of the mess but he's the one who needs to fix it or at least appear to. It doesn't appear to me that's he's really trying, except maybe now with the jobs bill. However, he needs to concentrate on bringing jobs back from overseas. Both union and non union jobs went overseas and he needs to concentrate on bringing them back by offering tax breaks to companies who bring them back and tax increases on jobs that refuse to. To his credit he did try to pass through an outsourcing bill but was defeated by Republicans and a few "Democrats" including asswipe Lieberman. Oh, and the jobs bill - History has proven that works programs are successful, austerity measures are nothing but fail. FDR's programs were very successful, that is until 1939, when the newly elected republican majority cut funding for his programs. The economy was sent into a tailspin from which it did not recover during WW2, the war increased the country's debt. It wasn't until the 1950s, when the tax rate on the wealthy reached an all-time high, and veterans were spending their GI loans, that the economy recovered. Eisenhower had a works program, too - the Interstate Highway System. I never said much about the works bill but it has good and bad. Yes, it'll help put back people on jobs, but in some states like Illinois many of the jobs will go to "connected" people. Also, I suspect many illegals will get these jobs because they can be paid low. Also, these type of jobs don't help everyone. I couldn't do a job like these and neither could everyone else. However if it helps people get back on their feet I am for it, because it means more consumer spending, which means more jobs and a better economy. |
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Where to begin...