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Post by mynick7 on Aug 2, 2015 16:22:02 GMT -5
Wow. After reading Aglewis's responses I have to side with Skinburn. It seems like Aglewis doesn't really like DD like most of us here do. He says he doesn't know what "supporting the band" means, and just wants to "discuss DD". He's probably better off at a general music forum where there may be some casual fans. But this is not really the place for the casual DD fan, is it? This is the place where the participants consider DD to be their favorite or at least among their favorites band. If a fan is a favorite, it's only natural that you would support them because of all the pleasure and happiness they have given to you for years. if you can't even understand that simple idea, then there is nothing anyone can say to help you understand why you are facing some harsh criticism. And BTW, having a band be your favorite doesn't mean that the band is beyond reproach. Far from it. We all (well, most of us), love the band but know there are aspects and works of theirs that we don't like, and many of us feel fine in expressing that. But we voice it with respect and benevolence, because the band has earned that respect by creating such beautiful music that has filled our lives with joy for over 35 years now. If I can't show them a little respect for that, then I wouldn't call myself a fan. Good luck, Aglewis! You're on your own from here on out! You think the casual DD fan would be able to have a conversation with me on this detail? About how each tour used to differ but now since the reunion, each show sounds and looks the same? Or about how each album up until Astronaut including medaz and pop trash have their own feeling of "moving forward"? they wont even KNOW these albums. To be honest... i was a DIE HARD fan up until the reunion. The entire 90's I was Die Hard #1. But that was because I LOVED what they were churning out year after year ( a big part now I see has to do with Warren )... Maybe I am not as big as a fan today - but so what? Why can't I discuss Duran Duran here? I don't get the herd mentality here at all. Do you get personally offended if I say things like Duran are phoning it in, sacrificing integrity for sales, etc... Why would you? The mentality of this particular herd on this topic is that we are sick of your complaining and beeaatching. You aren't even discussing anything...just constant negative complaining about one thing or another.
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Post by josefk on Aug 2, 2015 16:38:18 GMT -5
Great read Coolbarn – passionate about your position as always.
My post was really to tease out a bit more of aglewis723’s views based on his initial comments on this thread. Are bands like corporations with songs as their product? I think the analogy works for the most part but cannot account for the artistic factor. Why do the members of this band continue to work together to produce new songs? What motivates and drives them? Clearly it’s not about the money I agree, but is it all just for the sake of creative expression? Based on statements made by the band themselves, I think they are driven to reach the heights they once achieved in the 80’s and 90’s. Why make an international record deal with Warners if that is not your goal? Why sign with the William Morris agency if you don’t want to conquer the world? Yes they are true artists but they also have a fiery determination (for men of a certain age) that I find inspiring. They will do whatever it takes to succeed in the musical landscape they find themselves at the time. If I as a fan have to wade through a few Nite Runners and Skin Divers to get to the great songs, so be it.
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rtm
NOTORIOUS
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Post by rtm on Aug 2, 2015 16:48:36 GMT -5
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Post by coolbarn on Aug 2, 2015 18:06:09 GMT -5
Thank you for your kind words Josefk. You raise a number of interesting questions yourself. Why do the members of this band continue to work together to produce new songs? What motivates and drives them? I think they are all naturally artistic people. As a former drummer there IS something intoxicating about making new music. Nothing can really compare to having kids, but it is a bit like having a new child for a while. You invest so much of yourself into a new song. You write it, you change things (although none of us spent anywhere near as much time tinkering as Duran do in the studio; we'd just cobble it together and polish for as short as time as possible until we thought it sounded brilliant and that was it - done), and when you're finished you have something you are proud of. Basically I think it keeps artistic and inventive people like Duran Duran fresh. None of them want to play only the hits every night (even though it may seem like it from some of Duran's setlists) so it can give them some variety as well, which is important when they are on tour. Clearly it’s not about the money I agree, but is it all just for the sake of creative expression? Based on statements made by the band themselves, I think they are driven to reach the heights they once achieved in the 80’s and 90’s. Why make an international record deal with Warners if that is not your goal? Why sign with the William Morris agency if you don’t want to conquer the world? I don't think they want quite the same level of fame. I know they don't want to be at the stage where they are frightened to leave their house because of all the screaming, rabid fans outside. But I think like all artists they just want validation of their work, and receiving lots of rave reviews and selling lots of records helps achieve this. Making their fans feel good makes them feel good - it's win-win for everyone Yes they are true artists but they also have a fiery determination (for men of a certain age) that I find inspiring. Very true. Most of their contemporaries disbanded decades ago. We are so fortunate to love a band with such longevity. I'm sure a number of times along the way they have been tempted to quit for various reasons, but with the support of their families, friends, and fans, and of course each other, they have persevered and we (and them) have benefited as a result. There's that symbiotic relationship at work again! No matter what job you do, you get sick of it eventually. How good would it be to be a very well-paid professional sportsman? However I'm sure your favourite sports star just wants to sleep in from time to time, or shop, or do anything other than train and practise. But it's the constant training and practising which helps get them to that position in the first place. Same with Duran. They are so lucky doing something that they love, something that is a hobby at best for most exponents, and making a very good living in the process. But no matter the advantages, I'm sure they get sick of catching the same planes, living out of a suitcase, answering the same questions from interviewers, and playing the same songs, all the while missing their beautiful families. Nevertheless they DO stay determined. And good on them for being able to maintain this! They will do whatever it takes to succeed in the musical landscape they find themselves at the time. If I as a fan have to wade through a few Nite Runners and Skin Divers to get to the great songs, so be it. Of course you're not going to love every song Duran Duran writes; not every song is going to be a triumphant success. My issue with "having to wade through a few Nite Runners and Skin Divers" is hopefully in the future we DON'T have wade through such murky waters. Without turning this into an RCM discussion I feel Duran's music suffers the more they try to write a hit. I mean Timbabland had Nite Runner written before he even stepped foot in the studio - all the boys did is play what he had set out for them. Hopefully by now the boys realise the futility of trying to manufacture hits, and continue to make amazing music whether it adheres to current musical trends or not. Charts be damned - Duran Duran are real artists making magical, majestic music with memorable melodies. (Please excuse me being an annoying alliterative anus)
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razorfox
BIG THING
"Say Hello, To The Bad Guy....... fox, ...razor fox"
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Post by razorfox on Aug 3, 2015 7:08:10 GMT -5
Fu*K me I'm a fan of Duran Durans music as much as next person here but Jesus h Christ you wouldn't catch me writing the bollocks that has appeared in this thread.
Holy sh*t people, I can't even share my disbelief at what I see at time, how on earth do you get the time to write so much spill......
*will regret clicking "create post"*
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razorfox
BIG THING
"Say Hello, To The Bad Guy....... fox, ...razor fox"
Posts: 705
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Post by razorfox on Aug 3, 2015 7:10:18 GMT -5
how on earth do you get the time to write so much spill...... Scratch that as its probably the same amount of time I get to read it, ha! Anyway, Moving on....
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Post by coolbarn on Aug 3, 2015 11:39:15 GMT -5
Going by your replies Razorfox I think I could type faster than you can read. Actually I think the Venus De Milo could probably type faster than you can read.
Looking forward to your reply when you finish reading this post just before Paper Gods is released. Good day sir.
PS - Love you long time.
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razorfox
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"Say Hello, To The Bad Guy....... fox, ...razor fox"
Posts: 705
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Post by razorfox on Aug 3, 2015 13:10:57 GMT -5
*salutes* I will take the smackdown! It would take me twice as long as that to come back with a witty response. P.S Its "razorfox"
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oakey
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Post by oakey on Aug 3, 2015 20:22:28 GMT -5
Oh they are a company. Literally even. If they quit now, many people will be without jobs.
Of course they can retire and stop releasing new music and touring. Comfortably in our eyes even, but in their eyes it means they have to seriously downscale their living standards. The songwriting royalties from the backcatalogue alone may bring in (a few) millions a year, but they have to divide these millions among all songwriters (the four members now plus Warren, Andy, Sterling, Don etc). When you always fly bussiness or first class, cannot drive so need a personal chauffeur, eat out a lot and drink expensive champagne, or own multiple houses that need to be taken care of, amounts of money are spent on a yearly basis of which we (as in ordinary people) can only dream. Of course you can stop doing that and just retreat to a nice appartment in London, but that would not be the same for them, would it?
Many CEOs own way more than Duran's member, so why don't they retire? Basically because they like what they are doing and make a lot of money doing it. Some may even feel rsponsible for the people they employ who are depending on the bosses' success. It'll be the same with Duran Duran.
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Post by coolbarn on Aug 3, 2015 23:51:18 GMT -5
G'day there oakey, hope you are well mate Oh they are a company. Literally even. If they quit now, many people will be without jobs. I think you're overstating it a little with "many people" mate. Define many. Whose job would depend ENTIRELY on Duran Duran staying together and continuing to tour and producing new music? I can't think of anyone offhand who depends on Duran Duran only with no other avenues of making money. Of course Dom Brown would take a massive hit. But he still would receive royalties from All You Need Is Now, plus he sells his own music on his website. With Dom's loyalty to Duran Duran looking very good on the resume, plus the very positive way they speak of him, he would be able to continue making very good money virtually straight away. Good session musicians are not often seen sitting by the side of the road begging for loose change. Dom Brown will never make anywhere near as much money as Duran themselves of course, but he will certainly make a lot more than you, me, and most people reading this ever will. How about Katy Krassner? From katykrassner.com: My specialties include social media strategies, community management, execution, branding and managing websites, as well as editorial copy writing. I have written media materials for Duran Duran, They Might Be Giants, Def Leppard, Morrissey, Damian Marley, Tori Amos, Robert Plant, John Fogerty, Jordin Sparks, Margaret Cho, Ben Taylor, One Eskimo and more, and also provide content for several entertainment based companies. She then goes on to say "Please find some samples of my work above. If you’re interested in learning more about what I do, please contact me". In other words she is a gun for hire. Sure Duran Duran is her major baby, but if Duran Duran break up right now and never make another song or perform another concert ever again, her website and job description is not going to disappear into cyberspace. What about Duran's roadies? It is very unlikely any of them only work for Duran and don't do anything else when the band aren't touring. If that is the case then they are the most overpaid roadies in history, and Duran Duran are the most generous employers in history. But that isn't the case Who have I forgotten? Who depends on Duran Duran being a current rock band and nothing else for income? So I wouldn't say "many people will be without jobs". The people who deal with Duran Duran, like their management group, promoters, record labels, publishers etc would be affected if Duran broke up, but only a little. They have plenty of other artists on their books to look after, so they certainly won't be without work because of a lack of Duran Duran. The real losers if Duran Duran break up is us. And we're simply fans - not employees. Of course they can retire and stop releasing new music and touring. Comfortably in our eyes even, but in their eyes it means they have to seriously downscale their living standards. The songwriting royalties from the backcatalogue alone may bring in (a few) millions a year, but they have to divide these millions among all songwriters (the four members now plus Warren, Andy, Sterling, Don etc). When you always fly bussiness or first class, cannot drive so need a personal chauffeur, eat out a lot and drink expensive champagne, or own multiple houses that need to be taken care of, amounts of money are spent on a yearly basis of which we (as in ordinary people) can only dream. Of course you can stop doing that and just retreat to a nice appartment in London, but that would not be the same for them, would it? Anybody who retires has to weigh up whether it is financially viable to do so - Duran Duran are not exempt from this. Either Duran are happy with less caviar and limousines, but more spare time, or if they wish to continue to live a five star existence then they need the five star pay packet to go with it. But there is a word for rich people who have gotten so used to luxuries that they feel they can't live without them - spoiled. I feel sorry for anybody who has more than enough money for the rest of their life, but feels they have to continue doing a well-paying job they are absolutely sick of because they would like to eat lobster every night instead of the pitiful roast and three veg we mere mortals enjoy. I honestly feel sorry for them. Maybe spending some time skipping a few meals in slums with dirty people suffering around them might bring them back down to earth for a while. NOTE: I am not saying Duran Duran hate their job and are only in it for the money. As I said they are naturally artistic people and love music. They are very good people who work hard to be paid well, and truly deserve any success they achieve. I'm just saying if the only reason they are still making music is because they want a number one album and it is purely a pursuit of money, then I feel sorry for them. And doubtless their art would suffer for it anyway. But I honestly don't believe this is the case, so it is a moot point Many CEOs own way more than Duran's member, so why don't they retire? Basically because they like what they are doing and make a lot of money doing it. Some may even feel rsponsible for the people they employ who are depending on the bosses' success. It'll be the same with Duran Duran. Have you ever worked for a large company with a well-paid CEO? I have and am. I can tell you the people they employ play NO part in the bosses thoughts. It is purely about the business's bottom line and the shareholders - the staff are just an expensive tool they need to appease those shareholders. If a company could get away without having to pay wages whatsoever and could use robots with very occasional maintenance costs, then they would say goodbye to their human staff quicker than they could say "Hello R2-D2, welcome to the firm". It's an interesting discussion though. I honestly don't believe that any rock band classifies as a company as such. Yes they do sell a product, which many companies do. Yes they need to be marketed and promoted, as many companies do. So they do share characteristics with companies, but this doesn't necessarily make them one.
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