oakey
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Post by oakey on Nov 17, 2019 4:40:40 GMT -5
Never listen to RCM. As an album in terms of songwriting it’s far more coherent than eg PT or Medazza, but it’s just not DD. To me it sounds like an anonymous American urban band, with a sound that sounds terribly dated. Nothing to enjoy there for me. There is so much more better music out there (pop and classical) that I struggle to find the time to listen to, so why waste it on subpar stuff.
Even PT or Medazza I play occasionally.
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Post by andre005 on Nov 17, 2019 18:51:14 GMT -5
Never listen to RCM. As an album in terms of songwriting it’s far more coherent than eg PT or Medazza, but it’s just not DD. To me it sounds like an anonymous American urban band, with a sound that sounds terribly dated. Nothing to enjoy there for me. There is so much more better music out there (pop and classical) that I struggle to find the time to listen to, so why waste it on subpar stuff. Even PT or Medazza I play occasionally. I disagree.. Valley, falling down, last man standing, box full of honey, and she's too much... Classic duran..even my non duran fans who heard nite runner and skin divers said those songs should have been released over FD...they loved the album..
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Post by aftertherain on Nov 18, 2019 4:01:58 GMT -5
In a previous thread, I included the following artists/songs as "songs that sound like DD" and of my list it was only RM, Japan/David S, which I believe sound or evoke the first two DD albums. With the remaining artists in my list I added my thoughts on other aspects of the DD sound one of which was hip hop and obviously not evident on their first two albums, yet nevertheless we've all heard elements of HH in DD's music via the brilliant "sin of the city", "hot head" and "bedroom toys" (or was the latter more rap?) regardless the DD sound isn't simply defined to DD album one and DD album two IMO. Unless of-course one loves living in the past or still is?
I mean why do the sum of us confine the DD sound to the first 2 or 3 LPs? When there's another 11 LPs?
Anyway, the artists which I eluded sounding like DD were:
Michael Jackson, Soul to soul, Japan, Lenny Kravitz, David Sylvian & Roxy Music
IMO DD have no stylistic boundary & I think this is the main reason for their longevity & I personally Thank God that they have no stylistic boundary.
Whoever disagrees with my opinion is free to do so and that's OK coz It's OK that our love for DD radically differs from fan to fan.
IMO No two people are they same hey and therefore to generalise that we are (or that we all do love in the same manner/level) may come across and or be an insulting thing indeed ! It does to me. (This obviously depends on how one feels about the generalisation itself/being stereotyped).
I read something recently on this board in regards to DD which I loved & that was
"Why limit and confine yourself to one particular style, when there are so many things to explore in both creation and life" or it was something along those lines anyway. I guess that too is literally the DD (actual bands) way of thinking.
I love the RCM LP & see n hear DD in it and indeed throughout it ! It's not my fault I process what I hear how I process it !
"The valley" despite its sparse-ness is an epic song similar to "the reflex" LP version and "rio" too. Not in its contemporary sound but definitely in DNA, eg, every player (DD member) is heard on their own accord/merit & SLB is identifiable as usual.
Recently the family and I had a party at our place when Zoom In came on & a friend of ours who had never heard of it before, mentioned that this song is typical DD, I never mentioned to them who produced it or anything coz it wasn't important. Yet in their opinion all the DD elements were evident in Zoom In.
Interestingly from the RCM LP there are two songs which I don't particularly like "zoom in" is one and the other is "tricked out". The remainder of the LP is essential DD for that period in time circa 2007. It's cultural thing of its time and DD are a modern band whether some people want them to be or not. When haven't DD tried to attain the current mode?
It would have been nice if the LP had got radio-play for DD's sake (& ours) however aren't DD "unfortunately" accustomed to this umm regardless of the high quality recording & who their producer is? Aside from the first 3 or 4 and TWA
IMO Skin Divers is the most DD sounding/feel track on the album it has all the ingredients which make the fabulous DD soup. With or without T's rap coz his rap evident or not, is irrelevant, the song stands up as undeniably DD, with or without the rap, that's how my ears process what I hear when I play it anyway. It's dense, layered, groovy n funky in a modern way for the current mode of when it was recorded. In addition I love Dom's Hendrix guitar on FD
Yet feel free to differ coz we all process what we hear differently which inevitably results in ones level of appreciation, doesn't it.
Lastly (& by no means to I mean this offensively) but I recommend that if anyone doesn't like a DD song, simply don't listen to it. Honestly do yourself that favour, based on your opinion or do your opinion/ love for DD, the justice it deserves.
All I know is that I owe DD "big time" for 40 years of pleasure !
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oakey
PAPER GOD
Posts: 2,600
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Post by oakey on Nov 18, 2019 4:27:07 GMT -5
Never listen to RCM. As an album in terms of songwriting it’s far more coherent than eg PT or Medazza, but it’s just not DD. To me it sounds like an anonymous American urban band, with a sound that sounds terribly dated. Nothing to enjoy there for me. There is so much more better music out there (pop and classical) that I struggle to find the time to listen to, so why waste it on subpar stuff. Even PT or Medazza I play occasionally. I disagree.. Valley, falling down, last man standing, box full of honey, and she's too much... Classic duran..even my non duran fans who heard nite runner and skin divers said those songs should have been released over FD...they loved the album.. They did not buy the album in masses though. Remember seeing the special edition CD box of this album in the sales bin for less than €2 not long after the release! And yes, if Duran were to make a heavy metal album that would be Duran’s 2020 sound. That does not mean it would be great music though or in any way original. But good to hear that at least some of us enjoyed RCM. To me it sounds like they were TimberTimba’s minions, not an original DD product.
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Post by madoldlu on Nov 18, 2019 14:33:10 GMT -5
I mean why do the sum of us confine the DD sound to the first 2 or 3 LPs? When there's another 11 LPs? Personally, I think this way because I feel like that time frame was when DD was the most "themselves". I realize the first 3 albums they were heavily influenced by Bowie, RM, Chic, etc., but IMO they managed to take that influence and turn it into something new, original and uniquely them. I feel that by Notorious/Big Thing, outside influences started to overshadow their own personality, and definitely by Liberty. So for me, whereas before DD were creating new sounds, they then were sounding like whatever was popular, and sometimes even a little behind the times. In other words, for the first 3 DD sounded like DD, and for the rest, DD sounded like _________ (popular artist/sound of the time). Just my opinion. Did that make sense?
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Post by heskethbang on Nov 18, 2019 15:44:42 GMT -5
God RCM. What the hell was that all about? Sony Records have a lot to answer for. Taking on other peoples' genres is fun for a song or two, but a whole album? Who was the target audience? Other people do those genres so much better. It was such a disjointed collection of songs - Tempted, Box full O'Honey (WTF was that song all about??!!) and Skin Divers, which sounded like the DD sound in chains, trying to break free, but failing as DocMartens or whatever shoe he's named after starts talking over the top of it! Falling Down sounded like a man in his 50's wearing over tight jeans trying to sound hip. Most unbecoming. RCM was the only Tour I missed since my first DD gig - Big Live Thing Xmas '88. Thankfully they redeemed themselves on the following album, only to repeat similar disasters on Paper Gods.
Surely there's a way of presenting themselves in a cool understated way that reflects who they really are, not trying to be rappers or teen idols.
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Post by riomar on Nov 18, 2019 17:50:05 GMT -5
[/quote]Personally, I think this way because I feel like that time frame was when DD was the most "themselves". I realize the first 3 albums they were heavily influenced by Bowie, RM, Chic, etc., but IMO they managed to take that influence and turn it into something new, original and uniquely them. I feel that by Notorious/Big Thing, outside influences started to overshadow their own personality, and definitely by Liberty. So for me, whereas before DD were creating new sounds, they then were sounding like whatever was popular, and sometimes even a little behind the times. In other words, for the first 3 DD sounded like DD, and for the rest, DD sounded like _________ (popular artist/sound of the time). Just my opinion.
Did that make sense?[/quote]
It certainly did! Fantastically put!
Particularly the bit 'sometimes even a little behind the times', especially with the Big Thing (I'm currently listening to Top of the Pops 88, on UK TV. IDWYL was on, and it sounded desperately dull, slow, and a poor attempt at sounding current. It had no energy at all), Liberty, Medazzaland, Pop Thrash (shocking attempt at sounding like Oasis, who I dislike anyway) and RCM. Dare I say that the Duran sound existed, and they were original sounding.... until they started to manage themselves? Too much control?
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oakey
PAPER GOD
Posts: 2,600
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Post by oakey on Nov 19, 2019 1:27:34 GMT -5
It’s not just Duran, many artists struggle to stay relevant, innovative, and contemporary. Not just in music but also in other arts like painting etc.
Even the big names were considered past their time at some point: Bowie, Prince. The Stones. Fashions change, new generations like other things.
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Post by aftertherain on Nov 19, 2019 3:24:38 GMT -5
I mean why do the sum of us confine the DD sound to the first 2 or 3 LPs? When there's another 11 LPs? Personally, I think this way because I feel like that time frame was when DD was the most "themselves". I realize the first 3 albums they were heavily influenced by Bowie, RM, Chic, etc., but IMO they managed to take that influence and turn it into something new, original and uniquely them. I feel that by Notorious/Big Thing, outside influences started to overshadow their own personality, and definitely by Liberty. So for me, whereas before DD were creating new sounds, they then were sounding like whatever was popular, and sometimes even a little behind the times. In other words, for the first 3 DD sounded like DD, and for the rest, DD sounded like _________ (popular artist/sound of the time). Just my opinion. Did that make sense? Hey M I very much agree, I get what you're meaning however I see a difference in direction and sound between the first three LPs. & DD were experimenting way back then too Eg "my own way" the single version does not fit on either 81 DD LP or RIO LP, they had to change it to suit the Rio LP didn't they. I remember back in the day a school friend of mine Emil being pissed off with the LP version. If my memory serves me correctly? he hadn't purchased the single version and was waiting for it to be included on Rio, to his surprise and/or shock it was way slower than the single. He was like why is that? Believing that the exact single version should be on the LP I also remember a friend of my sisters (Stan) who would study with her/swap Uni notes (they were in their late teens & I was in my early teens) he was raving about this new band DD and their debut LP yet when Rio was released he wasn't into them whatsoever. It is possible that DD didn't sound indie/dark enough anymore or it could have been the teen thing ? IMO, FOM verges on punk, NB is dark n goth like & TAviv hauntingly with an eastern flavour. For me the DD LP is uk/European sounding whereas Rio is totally American & IMO S&TRT verges on world music to an extent, that's how my ears process it. DD usually give an LP a theme or particular mode don't they. However Big Thing is an exception considering every song tasted different on that LP ! Therefore if DD decide (for whatever reason to work with Timberland) the LPs theme is highly likely to sound like at the time/circa Nelly Furtado, Justin T, missy E etc whether we like it or not, yet for me undeniably I see the DD elements in RCM despite its circa popular music/timber production. Like isn't it a good thing timb a never produced every song? Here's the thing one must take into consideration the sign of the times. In the early 80s Nile R produced INXS Bowie Madonna & DD just to name the big ones, yet each act/artist were their own individual sound identity. That doesn't happen anymore were all being err umm dumbed down a bit culturally. Everyone's wearing similar things eg the same sneakers, many women straighten their hair & there's hardly any flair in gentlemens clothes these days and so there ain't much individuality, same goes for music. Eg my daughter wears much the same as what all her friends are wearing & straightens her hair coz all her girlfriends do. Getting back to RCM, when I hear the sax on DGM or the Hendrix like guitar on FD it brings forth something interesting and unique that still makes me awfully proud to be a Duranie regardless coz in my book in aprox 80% of DD's works I find pleasing. Thing is it doesn't gel with me that I love DD yet bag critique or bluntly critzize, complain, nag etc etc coz I want my band to do this and hence want my voice "ego" heard, when undeniably deep down I love way more of DDs music than the 15% - 20% which I don't absolutely love. But again everyone loves differently and that's OK
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Post by medazzaboy1997 on Nov 19, 2019 12:52:59 GMT -5
I have a problem listening to RCM. This is not DD. There's no real bass and drums. Timbaland's rap is a complete disaster. Can you imagine Timbaland rapping for example on Depeche Mode?
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